Help me understand the race notation.

Armando,

Over the past few years there have been numerous inquiries regarding French relations within Jalisco/Mexico in our genealogy searches. You and several others have often replied that there was little to no influence. I was very interested because some merchants in my family came from Jalisco, and the stories say that in addition to our Spanish ancestry, we also had French ancestry in Mexico. I have have found some French connections in Mexico, but not in Jalisco. When I visited Guadalajara a few years ago, I was surprised to see so many fabric stores and department stores in the downtown area. Surely the Barcelonnettes had a touch in these, but there are few accounts of the French in the Jalisco church records for the 1800's to early 1900's. Many of the Barcelonnettes were known to have returned to their homes in France to retire, but they also married and had children in Mexico.

In my research I have found quite a bit about the Barcelonnette's Mexican connection. They owned textile plants, dry goods stores, department stores, large banks and manufacturing plants. Today the French have large communities in Monterrey, Mexico City, San Luis Potosi, Puebla and suppposedly in Guadalajara. Every August the Vallée de l’Ubaye, France celebrates its historic links with Mexico in a Latino-Mexican festival. The following is from the website www.mountainpassions.com/summer/summer_activities/ubaye_festival_mexic
"The Arnaud brothers (who pioneered the emigration) arrived in Mexico in 1818, and within fifty years owned numerous shops, a network of sales representatives in every country and outlets in Europe. Their success attracted friends and family from Ubaye to cross the Atlantic and join their compatriots. Little by little, the new entrepreneurs became industrialists rather than shopkeepers, and controlled the textile industry in Mexico. They also built up a solid financial structure and established numerous banking institutions, even putting their signature at the foot of bank notes."

The most interesting website is www.webs2002.uab.es/dep-economia-empresa/documents/04-2.pdf This site is "The Barcelonnettes: An Example of Network-Entrepreneurs in XIX Century Mexico. An Explanation Based on a Theroy of Bounded Rational Choice with Social Embeddedness", by Gonzalo Castaneda from the Department de Economia Universidad de las Americas, Puebla.

You can also find the Barcelonnettes on Wikipedia.com, including the article "French Immigration to Mexico" where I found the following information:
The number of French Immigrants to Mexico during the years 1857-1976.

1857–1860 = 578
1861–1870 = 4,292
1871–1880 = 10,706
1881–1890 = 69,363
1891–1900 = 11,395
1901–1910 = 11,862
1911–1920 = 1,352
1921–1930 = 739
1931–1940 = 626
1941–1950 = 5,538
1951–1960 = 934
1961–1970 = 1,266
1971–1976 = 85

Total 116,032

Regards, Judith Marentes

Nuestros Ranchos Members:There were also individuals born in France, but who came to Mexico (sometimes via Spain) before and after the French Intervention. One example is Ángel Navarro, French-born leading Spanish settler in New Spain. My husband also has a gr gr gr gr grandmother (Maria Iturbide) from France who married a Basque man and they imigrated to Guanajuato, Mexico years after the French invasion. Their reason for immigrating was to join family who were already well established in the area. The following article discusses French immigration to Mexico, how many actually came, where they immigrated from, where they immigrated to, and notable Mexicans with French ancestry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_immigration_to_Mexico Here is also a French genealogy blog that discusses French immigration to Mexico (even before the French Intervention): http://french-genealogy.typepad.com/genealogie/2012/01/french-immigrants-to-mexico.html
> Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2012 07:38:31 -0700
> From: longsjourney [at] yahoo [dot] com
> To: research [at] NuestrosRanchos [dot] com
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] French or not?
>
> actually I did find 2 marriages in Jerez, Zac for former French soldiers marrying women from Jerez.. So there are 2 families with French blood in Jerez one who did have children there.
> Linda in B.C.
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Alicia Carrillo
> To: "research [at] NuestrosRanchos [dot] com"
> Sent: Friday, July 6, 2012 1:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] French or not?
>
> Armando and other Nuestros Ranchos Members:
>
> Why do you think so many people perpetuate the myth that they're French or have French lineage? I simply cannot understand the why. I know I've heard it said by some people in our family and when I tell people that I've done some genealogical research, inevitably this comes up and they say that they are descended from the French. I hear it all the time and I've even alienated some people when I give them a few facts as to the short time period in which the French occupied Mexico and that it's simply not possible or very unlikely that they could be French.
>
>
> The British, French and Spanish arrived in Mexico during the Mexican reform period beginning in October of 1861 because Presidente Juarez had refused to pay Mexico's foreign debts.
>
>
> The French first occupied Puebla, and were defeated on 5 de Mayo of 1862, hence el Cinco de Mayo. The following May, the French again attacked Puebla, then proceeded to Mexico City where they took over the government. Maximilian was asked to accept the Mexican Crown for the French, which he did in accordance with Napolean's plans and wishes. Maximilian arrived in 1864 with his wife Carlota and In 1866, Napolean began recalling the French troops from Mexico. In 1867, Maximilan was tried and executed in Mexico.
>
> So the French were in Mexico from 1861 to 1867. I'm curious to hear what people's thoughts are on this issue of so many people claiming they are French in Mexico.
>
>
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Ca
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________

This group is for serious genealogists actively searching for lineages in
the states of Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.

Also, a lot of people have lost sight of what has caused this discussion to
come about and the reason behind it. There are hundreds, maybe even
thousands, of people with ancestry in Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes
that are told they have French ancestry but when their family trees are
seriously researched there isn't a single French ancestor in the past 400
years and wouldn't matter if 10 million French had immigrated to Jalisco,
Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.

Respectfully,
Armando

On Tue, Jul 10, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Leni Rivera wrote:

>
> Nuestros Ranchos Members:There were also individuals born in France, but
> who came to Mexico (sometimes via Spain) before and after the French
> Intervention. One example is Ángel Navarro, French-born leading Spanish
> settler in New Spain. My husband also has a gr gr gr gr grandmother (Maria
> Iturbide) from France who married a Basque man and they imigrated to
> Guanajuato, Mexico years after the French invasion. Their reason for
> immigrating was to join family who were already well established in the
> area. The following article discusses French immigration to Mexico, how
> many actually came, where they immigrated from, where they immigrated to,
> and notable Mexicans with French ancestry:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_immigration_to_Mexico Here is also a
> French genealogy blog that discusses French immigration to Mexico (even
> before the French Intervention):
> http://french-genealogy.typepad.com/genealogie/2012/01/french-immigrants-to-mexico.html
> > Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2012 07:38:31 -0700
> > From: longsjourney [at] yahoo [dot] com
> > To: research [at] NuestrosRanchos [dot] com
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] French or not?
> >
> > actually I did find 2 marriages in Jerez, Zac for former French soldiers
> marrying women from Jerez.. So there are 2 families with French blood in
> Jerez one who did have children there.
> > Linda in B.C.
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Alicia Carrillo
> > To: "research [at] NuestrosRanchos [dot] com"
> > Sent: Friday, July 6, 2012 1:41 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] French or not?
> >
> > Armando and other Nuestros Ranchos Members:
> >
> > Why do you think so many people perpetuate the myth that they're French
> or have French lineage? I simply cannot understand the why. I know I've
> heard it said by some people in our family and when I tell people that I've
> done some genealogical research, inevitably this comes up and they say that
> they are descended from the French. I hear it all the time and I've even
> alienated some people when I give them a few facts as to the short time
> period in which the French occupied Mexico and that it's simply not
> possible or very unlikely that they could be French.
> >
> >
> > The British, French and Spanish arrived in Mexico during the Mexican
> reform period beginning in October of 1861 because Presidente Juarez had
> refused to pay Mexico's foreign debts.
> >
> >
> > The French first occupied Puebla, and were defeated on 5 de Mayo of
> 1862, hence el Cinco de Mayo. The following May, the French again attacked
> Puebla, then proceeded to Mexico City where they took over the government.
> Maximilian was asked to accept the Mexican Crown for the French, which he
> did in accordance with Napolean's plans and wishes. Maximilian arrived in
> 1864 with his wife Carlota and In 1866, Napolean began recalling the French
> troops from Mexico. In 1867, Maximilan was tried and executed in Mexico.
> >
> > So the French were in Mexico from 1861 to 1867. I'm curious to hear what
> people's thoughts are on this issue of so many people claiming they are
> French in Mexico.
> >
> >
> > Alicia,
> > San Jose, Ca
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
>

?????
> Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2012 16:50:24 -0500
> From: fandemma [at] gmail [dot] com
> To: research [at] nuestrosranchos [dot] com
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] French or not?
>
> This group is for serious genealogists actively searching for lineages in
> the states of Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.
>
> Also, a lot of people have lost sight of what has caused this discussion to
> come about and the reason behind it. There are hundreds, maybe even
> thousands, of people with ancestry in Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes
> that are told they have French ancestry but when their family trees are
> seriously researched there isn't a single French ancestor in the past 400
> years and wouldn't matter if 10 million French had immigrated to Jalisco,
> Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.
>
> Respectfully,
> Armando
>
> On Tue, Jul 10, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Leni Rivera wrote:
>
> >
> > Nuestros Ranchos Members:There were also individuals born in France, but
> > who came to Mexico (sometimes via Spain) before and after the French
> > Intervention. One example is Ángel Navarro, French-born leading Spanish
> > settler in New Spain. My husband also has a gr gr gr gr grandmother (Maria
> > Iturbide) from France who married a Basque man and they imigrated to
> > Guanajuato, Mexico years after the French invasion. Their reason for
> > immigrating was to join family who were already well established in the
> > area. The following article discusses French immigration to Mexico, how
> > many actually came, where they immigrated from, where they immigrated to,
> > and notable Mexicans with French ancestry:
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_immigration_to_Mexico Here is also a
> > French genealogy blog that discusses French immigration to Mexico (even
> > before the French Intervention):
> > http://french-genealogy.typepad.com/genealogie/2012/01/french-immigrants-to-mexico.html
> > > Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2012 07:38:31 -0700
> > > From: longsjourney [at] yahoo [dot] com
> > > To: research [at] NuestrosRanchos [dot] com
> > > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] French or not?
> > >
> > > actually I did find 2 marriages in Jerez, Zac for former French soldiers
> > marrying women from Jerez.. So there are 2 families with French blood in
> > Jerez one who did have children there.
> > > Linda in B.C.
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Alicia Carrillo
> > > To: "research [at] NuestrosRanchos [dot] com"
> > > Sent: Friday, July 6, 2012 1:41 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] French or not?
> > >
> > > Armando and other Nuestros Ranchos Members:
> > >
> > > Why do you think so many people perpetuate the myth that they're French
> > or have French lineage? I simply cannot understand the why. I know I've
> > heard it said by some people in our family and when I tell people that I've
> > done some genealogical research, inevitably this comes up and they say that
> > they are descended from the French. I hear it all the time and I've even
> > alienated some people when I give them a few facts as to the short time
> > period in which the French occupied Mexico and that it's simply not
> > possible or very unlikely that they could be French.
> > >
> > >
> > > The British, French and Spanish arrived in Mexico during the Mexican
> > reform period beginning in October of 1861 because Presidente Juarez had
> > refused to pay Mexico's foreign debts.
> > >
> > >
> > > The French first occupied Puebla, and were defeated on 5 de Mayo of
> > 1862, hence el Cinco de Mayo. The following May, the French again attacked
> > Puebla, then proceeded to Mexico City where they took over the government.
> > Maximilian was asked to accept the Mexican Crown for the French, which he
> > did in accordance with Napolean's plans and wishes. Maximilian arrived in
> > 1864 with his wife Carlota and In 1866, Napolean began recalling the French
> > troops from Mexico. In 1867, Maximilan was tried and executed in Mexico.
> > >
> > > So the French were in Mexico from 1861 to 1867. I'm curious to hear what
> > people's thoughts are on this issue of so many people claiming they are
> > French in Mexico.
> > >
> > >
> > > Alicia,
> > > San Jose, Ca
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> > >
> > > To post, send email to:
> > > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> > >
> > > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> > > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> > >
> > > To post, send email to:
> > > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> > >
> > > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> >