You are hereForums / Genealogy Research / Moctezuma II descendientes

Moctezuma II descendientes

warning: Creating default object from empty value in /home/lafamilia/nuestrosranchos.com/sites/all/modules/mailhandler/mailhandler.module on line 123.

By AngelicaGarcia - Posted on 12 April 2019

Busco información y contactos con descendientes de Moctuzuma II, en particular con hijos de Leonor Valderrama de Moctezuma, madre de Petronila de Moctezuma.

Dear Rachael

I too am curious. A few years ago I was trying to untangle the Sotelo lines in Spain, Mexico and South America...very intersting family but I did not get further back (with reasonable certainty) than Diego Sotelo's parents.

Regards
Denise Fastrup

Happy New Year,

Rachel,

I was very surprised to hear about Conquistador Cristóbal Valderrama’s ancestry as I don’t even know who his parents are. The information that I have is that:

He was accused of being a practicing Jew.
He was from “Valderrama, partido de la Sierra en Tobalina, Burgos, Castilla y León, Spain”,
He was born in 1490/1495 in Barcelona, provincia da Cataluña, Spain,
He married Mariana “Leonor” Moctezuma in 1931 as her second husband,
He is mentioned in the early history of Michoacan where he was given the encomienda of Tarimbaro in 1526. His wife Mariana/ Leonor already owned the encomienda of Ecatepac prior to their marriage.
He passed away in Ciudad Mexico, D.F., Mexico in November of 1537.

I don’t have any records at all indicating leads as to who his parents are, or any mention of a descent from Charlemagne. I would appreciate any information on Cristóbal Valderrama’s ancestry.

=====/====================/==========================================
First known evidence of Leonor Moctezuma /Sotelo /Petronila connection to Moctezuma:

The first known appearance of evidence is a family chart that appears in 1574.

The first document that I read is dated 1595 and the scribe is quoting Lope Ruiz De Esparza.

======================================================================

Denise,

I also found the Sotelo family to be very interesting. The accusations against this family in “inquisicion” records shows us how ugly the inquisition really was. This family’s christian faith was truly put to the test.

The star that served as a beacon for Christian faith is a member of the Sotelo family. In comparison, Sor Juana Ines De la Cruz stands out as a beacon for women, and men, for her Intelligence, her stand on women’s rights, and her poems. Juana Ines de la Cruz’s christian faith was admirable, but the beacon for Her religious faith was a member of the Sotelo family as she stood up and fought the inquistion. Her story is the highlight in my book on the Sotelo family.

Thanks,
Rick A. Ricci
Source: Mygenes2000

Hello Rachel, Batch # F868769, Sheet 031, Source 1396289 would have been created by Jaime Holcombe Isunza, q.e.p.d., and are not available online. See http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/en/node/14203#comment-29226 and https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/319732?availability=Family%20History%20Library

I have copies of some of his Family Group Sheets. They have names of the esposo, esposa, sometimes the names of the parents of the esposo and esposa, the names of the children of the esposo and esposa, and their children and the spouse of the children and the dates of each of them as well as the source information. Unfortunately the source information is the film number in Mexico and not the LDS film number but if there is a number it means there is a microfilm with information about one or more of the family members. By now we would have copies of all of the information on the sheets since they are all based on the same microfilms that have been digitized and placed online.

I uploaded a copy of the FGS sheet of Tomás de Villalobos cc Catarina Macias Valadez to Google drive at https://bit.ly/2QmjujL so you can see what the FGS sheets look like.

I also uploaded, to the same folder, a Microsoft document with letters by Jaime Holcombe Isunza to Mary Lou Montagna that she was willing to share with us some years ago. Jaime Holcombe mentions records that include references to Petronila de Moctezuma.

SHARR is at https://shhar.org/ and stands for Society of Hispanic Historical and Ancestral Research

It seems that the earliest document that anyone has found and shared that mentions Petronila de Moctezuma was in 1702 in the dispensa of Tomasa de la Rosa y Ulloa. There is a link to it at https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/De_Moctezuma-1 I uploaded a full transcription of it to the Google drive. It mentions her as hija de Pedro de Ulloa Marquez nieta de María Ruiz de Esparza bisnieta de Francisca Gabai y tercera nieta de los dichos Martin Navarro y Doña Petronila Montesuma.

Supposedly Martín Navarro Gabay received a grant for land between Mexticacán and Acasico in 1570. That is another document that would be a great find.

I have a copy of Retoños de España en La Nueva Galicia Tomo VII (2011) by Mariano González Leal which has a section on Moctezuma which mentions doña Petronila Moctezuma as a wife of Martín de Gabay, conocido como el Navarro, and as a daughter of doña Leonor de Valderrama y Moctezuma and of Diego de Arias Sotelo and as the granddaughter of Cristóbal de Valderrama and of Leonor de Moctezuma and as the great-granddaughter of Moctezuma II. This section is all based on the research by don Guillermo Tovar de Teresa, q.e.p.d.. This document that don Guillermo Tovar de Teresa had found is the one that all of us need to put to rest the speculation of her ancestry.

PARES (Portal de Archivos Españoles) is at http://pares.mcu.es/ and there are a huge number of digitized records from Mexico on the site. You can do a simple search or if you already have the section that the record is found in and the signatura then you can do an advanced search.

There is descendant tree of Moctezuma created about 1574 that mentions doña Leonor casada con Xpoval de Valderrama and that they had Leonor de Valderrama who married Diego Arias Sotelo and they had a son named don Fernando Sotelo who would have been the brother of Petronila de Moctezuma if the hypothesis of her ancestry is correct. The tree stated that there are other children of Leonor de Valderrama and Diego Arias Sotelo.

To see the tree go to http://pares.mcu.es/ then to Busqueda Avanzada then to FILTRO POR SIGNATURA then paste the following PATRONATO,245,R.5 then click Buscar.

Since we are talking about potentially, or likely, being descendants of Diego de Arias Sotelo I should point out that some sites mention his death as July 7, 1566 when in reality that is the date he and his brother were ordered to appear in Mexico City. Título de la unidad: "Proceso contra Diego Arias de Sotelo:rebelión Nueva España" Archivo: Archivo General de Indias Signatura: PATRONATO,217,R.3 Fecha Creación: 1566

Diego de Arias Sotelo was still alive in 1573, and maybe even in 1587, according to documents found at PARES.

Hi Rick

I have been trying to remember the name of the Sotelo lady who was Lutheran in the 16th century, I think it was Marina de Saavedra, married to Pedro Cisneros de Sotelo.

Very interesting story about her, written by Doris Moreno Martinez:
https://books.google.dk/books?id=9QS4CwAAQBAJ&pg=PT347&dq=sotelo+marina+Saavedra&hl=es&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjgi4v_j-3mAhXHG5oKHTagDAsQ6AEIODAC#v=onepage&q=sotelo%20marina%20Saavedra&f=false

Devout Laywomen in the Early Modern World
editado por Alison Weber (Chapter 10 is about Marina de Saavedra)

There are several Sotelos mentioned here, some of which are the same people mentioned in the comments in this thread here in NR:
http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/en/node/21997

With regard to the parentage of Diego ARias de Sotelo, the problem has been to document that his father was the Sotelo who accompanied Hernan Cortes. To my knowledge, we do not have a source on that. It would have been great if Diego Sotelos Confirmation de Oficio of 1559 had mentioned it specifically...

Another interesting Sotelo: Pedro Arias Davila aka Pedrarias, mentioned in a letter from Diego Arias Sotelo to his son, who identifies him as Pedrarias de Sotelo -
see page 5 of the comments on this thread: http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/en/node/21906?page=4
There is a chapter on him in the book Rivers of Gold by Hugh Thomas. Unfortunately I have not been able to figure out how he is related to Diego...

Regards
Denise

Dear Denise,

Even though she was convicted for practicing Lutheranism, it appears that she was innocent in the sense that she believed that she was deepening her faith in Christianity, and did not see her self as practicing anything other than the Catholic religion. Her participation in prayer and scripture study groups seemed to her to be a deepening of her Catholic faith. She was a woman full of love for her neighbors and should have been considered a saint instead of a heretic. Her biggest mistake it seems was taking to heart the teachings of Erasmus. I only call it a mistake because of the persecution that she suffered because of it. She wasn’t the only Sotelo family member that was accused of heresy. What makes her stand out is her “innocence” just jumps out to the reader when you read about her life.

There was much controversy over the writings of Erasmus as he preached that the spread of Classical knowledge encouraged a better morality and greater understanding between people. Erasmus lectured and collaborated with Thomas More and other many brilliant fellow theologians of his time.

Erasmus never officially left the Catholic Church. Erasmus believed that what mattered most was a believer's direct relationship with God. After he passed away, the inquisition targeted people that studied his writings and charged them with heresy, Early in Erasmus’s life, he preached that Luther and others had gone too far and that they should seek reform within the church through proper channels instead of rebelling. Towards the end of Erasmus’s life he stopped preaching against the Protestants Radicalism and seemed to become disenchanted with the lack of progress of Catholic reforms. After Erasmus passed away, his name became associated with calls for reform so those that didn’t want any change claimed that only heretics read his writings. By the time of his death, most of the brilliant thinkers that he had collaborated had either passed away, become a Protestant, or stayed quiet in order to not have to deal with the inquisition.

For most of Erasmus’s life he was criticized by reformers for having to much patience with the Catholic Church and not pressing for immediate change. It is ironic that once he passed away that anyone promoting his ideas was placed under suspicion for heresy by the inquisition.

As you can readily tell, I look up to this Sotelo family member who I consider a Saint.

Wishing you a happy and fruitful new year,
Rick A. Ricci

Hi Rick

Thanks for the info on Marina de Saavedra, she was truly a courageous person during a time when a challenge to the Catholic church's dogma (or actions the church perceived as a challenge) could get you burned as a heretic - this was in fact the fate of her nephew Pedro de Sotelo. She herself was imprisoned for life at the order of the Inquisition. The record of her trial reveals that she both denied heresy and admitted to having believed, for a period of time, some of the heretical (Lutheran) doctrine. What she ultimately believed in her heart we will never know - she had a husband, two daughters and many sons who lives would be affected if she did not reconcile with the church. (This is from the text I mentioned in my previous post)... And yes, Erasmus is also a fascination figure that I know all too little about - added to my list of persons to read up on :)

As for Diego Arias Sotelo, we know for a fact that his brother was Baltasar Sotelo who was also implicated, found guilty, and beheaded for his part in the "conspiración de Martin Cortes." The record of the trial includes information about where their family is from - Zamora - and this is the same place where the Cisneros de Sotelo are based. So, Diego is somehow linked to Pedro Sotelo and the other Sotelos mention in the text on Marina de Saavedra, but as I have mentioned, I was never able to establish exactly how. HOPEFULLY someday someone will make it a master's thesis or something....

Wishing you a Happy New Year and continuing success in your geneaology research!
Regards
Denise

Hi Denise,

Marina de Saavedra was the wife of Pablo Cisneros Sotelo. Pablo is a brother of Conquistador Antonio Sotelo Cisneros. The Sotelo family that went to South America used Cisneros as the first surname Marina has her name written many different ways in the inquisition records: Sayabedra, Saavedra, Sallebedra are some of the surnames she used. Her first name has been given as Marina and Ana.

Pablo Cisneros Sotelo and Antonio de Sotelo y Cisneros are sons of don Pedro de Sotelo and doña Inés de Cisneros. Pablo and Antonio have two other brothers named Gregorio and Juan. Pedro’s father is Lope Sotelo. Pedro Sotelo has at least two brothers named Francisco and Alonso.

Even though Marina Saavedra was sentenced to life in prison on 21/May/1559, by 1567 she had already been allowed to return to her home.

One of the officials of the inquisition is a family member of the Sotelo family. I don’t know the exact relationship. His name is Inquisitor General Diego de Deza

I too have found it interesting that in a letter from Diego Arias Sotelo to his son, Diego identifies Pedro Arias De Avila as Pedrarias de Sotelo ( aka Pedro Arias Davila aka Pedrarias, )

Pedro Arias de Avila’s wife, mother and grandmother come from Jewish families that were recent converts to Catholicism under the forced conversions. His grandmother, Elvira Gonzalez, converted in 1411. His mother is a member of the Jewish Cota and Ortiz families from Toledo. His wife is a member of the Conversó Fernandez Bobadilla family These families were considered “cryptojews” even though some family members entered priesthood.

I have not been able to find the relationship between Pedro Arias Davila (Pedrarias de Sotelo) and Diego Arias Sotelo. Diego Arias Sotelo was not a recent convert, yet the family’s familiarity with studying scriptures leads to the conjecture that they had conversó ancestors. Studying scripture was part of common Jewish life and not common for Catholics unless they belonged to a religious order

Wishing you the best,
Thanks,
Rick A. Ricci
Source Mygenes2000

Hi Rick and NR members intersted in the Sotelo family

Very interesting with all those Sotelos, Rick! I checked in PARES and there are many entries with these names (and other Sotelos) in the 1500s.

I also did a search here in NR because several of us posted on Diego Arias Sotelo and his descendants some years ago - there is a lot from 2014. It was fun re-reading the old posts. It looks like we overlooked one interesting doc in PARES - sorry, the link doesn't work, so the path to the doc is copy-pasted here:

RESUMEN:
Título de la unidad: "Real cédula concediendo a Diego Arias Sotelo, vecino y regidor de México el término de un año para que la ausencia de Nueva España de Hernando Sotelo Moctezuma, su hijo y de Leonor Valderrama Moctezuma, no perjudique su derecho a la sucesión de los indios de dicha tierra si falleciese en dicho plazo."
Archivo: Archivo General de Indias
Signatura: MEXICO,1090,L.7,F.174V-175V
Soporte: contiene imágenes digitalizadas

indicador de lista abierta ÁREA DE IDENTIFICACIÓN
Código de Referencia:
ES.41091.AGI/23.10.1105//MEXICO,1090,L.7,F.174V-175V
Titulo Nombre atribuido:
Real cédula concediendo a Diego Arias Sotelo, vecino y regidor de México el término de un año para que la ausencia de Nueva España de Hernando Sotelo Moctezuma, su hijo y de Leonor Valderrama Moctezuma, no perjudique su derecho a la sucesión de los indios de dicha tierra si falleciese en dicho plazo.
Fecha Creación:
1573-5-27 Madrid
Nivel de Descripción:
Unidad Documental Simple

indicador de lista abierta ÁREA DE CONTEXTO
Nombre de/l (los) productor/es:
Consejo de Indias (España)

My Spanish is not good enough to understand everything, but I have a feeling you (Rick) and others would be able to read it without much problem, the handwriting is reasonably legible. Its easy to read "nieta de motecuma" for example, right after the name dona Leonor Valderrama Motecuma (...) muger.

So, if anyone has time to take a look at it...

Regards
Denise

http://pares.mcu.es/ParesBusquedas20/catalogo/show/7310811

Thank you. I too cannot easily read the early writings but can make out the request Vro. (Vruestro +Nuestro Hijo) and other words but it is clear Leonor nieta de Moctesuma. Once again thanks for the hard copy of evidence.

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.

Navigation

Who's online

There are currently 0 users and 1 guest online.

Languages