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Francisco Michel Ordones

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By coronaarechiga - Posted on 16 November 2014

I have found a major flaw in my tree. It seems I have fallen victim to the syndrome of "too many people with the same name." I somehow had combined Francisco Michel-Ordones (1), married to Michaela Lopez-Bueso, with Francisco Michel-Ordones (2), married to Manuela Lopez-Bueso and then to Lorenza Gertrudes Gonzales. My husband is a direct descendant of both of these men.

Francisco (1), was married to Michaela up to the time of his death in 1709:

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18721-8269-65?cc=1874591&wc=12508902

I have 7 children listed for this couple: Maria (Directly descended), Dominga, Domingo, Juana, Ascencio, Ignacio, Regina. I haven't located a marriage for this couple nor can I verify their parents...although there are several possibilities. A strong possibility is that he is the brother of Thomas Michel-Ordones, father of Francisco (2).

Francisco (2), was born to Thomas Michel-Ordones and Augustina Escobar in 1694 in Autlan:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18561-19394-40?cc=1874591&wc=12504693

was married to Manuela Lopez-Bueso until her death in 1742 in Sayula:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18571-57336-26?cc=1874591&wc=12509784

I have 5 children listed for this couple: Maria de la Concepcion, Juan Matias, Thomas, Julio Feliciano, and Justa Maria.

Francisco (2) married in 1744 in Sayula:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18578-4484-49?cc=1874591&wc=M99L-N21:1567847509

This couple had at least 6 children: Maria Magdalena (directly descended), Bernardino Jose, Juan Marcelo, Agustin Maria, Josef Francisco, and Thomas.

I've spent hours sorting out these two people and their families, but now I can't seem to be left with a swirl of information. I would greatly appreciate if someone could provide a life-preserver...or at least a stick.

Thank you,
Deedra Corona

Hello Gil,

You are way ahead of me. The oldest Garcia de Alba I have is Francisco married to Mariana Casilda Ortega Maldonado in Tecolotlan. I do have Juana Betancur Ruiz married to Francisco Ordones Corona, but no family for her. I also have Juana Michel Ordones Betancur (who I suspect is their daughter) married to Hernan Gonzales-Corona. I have Isabel Betancur Gomez married to Josef Brambila y Arrriaga in 1688 (Daughter of Nicolas Betancur and Isabel Gomez.

Deedra Corona

Hello Gil,
Thank you for this link. I have gone through this book several times and missed this and the baptism below it for Agustina Josefa Gonzales Corona.

The writing is a bit difficult to understand, but we are talking about the same family: Jesus (Luis) Navarrete and Luisa Corona. However, in reading it I believe the daughter's name is "Luisa Maria"; even though it says "Maria" in the column. Obviously she is the older sister of Hernando Navarrete. You know some of those women got married in their early teens and continued having children into their 40's. I know a couple who had a son younger than their own great-grandson! Also interesting is the madrina: Marianna Aguayo who baptized her own daughter only a few days later.

As far as Jesus vs. Luis I think it is possible that he went by both. Some people use a Christian or Biblical name along with a given name. When my kids were baptized the priest added Jose and Maria before their names. Its also possible that the when they got married the priest misunderstood "Luis" for "Jesus." I accept they are the same person.

It is very possible that Graciana and Luisa are sisters but until we have definitive proof it remains a "possibility."

Thank you for your help and insight,
Deedra Corona

Hola a todos,

He estado algo ausente de la Genealogía estos meses pero ocasionalmente reviso este foro y me encontré la discusión sobre este tema que esta relacionado con mis antepasados Michel.

Me parece muy valiosa la información que han aportado hasta ahora, pero tengo una duda que espero alguien pueda resolverme...De acuerdo a los datos que tengo Juan Michel Ordoñez y Graciana Corona tuvieron por hijo a Francisco Michel Ordoñez que casó con Juana de Betancur y Ruiz y ellos son los padres de Juana, Nicolasa y Salvador. La duda es que a Tomás Michel esposo de Agustina de Vargas-Machuca y Escobar, lo tengo como hijo de Francisco Michel Ordoñez y Corona pero a su madre con el nombre de Luisa de Guzmán. Entonces Francisco casó en dos ocasiones? Tomás y los demás Michel son en realidad medios hermanos? Y de ser así sabemos algo sobre la familia de Luisa de Guzmán?

Gracias y saludos.
Enrique Agraz

Hello Enrique Agraz, How wonderful of you to join the party!

It is possible, again, that there are too many people with the name of Thomas Michel...as well as Francisco Michel. Personally I have 5 Thomas Micheles in my tree, some may be people that I have been unable to hook up with their families.

There is a Thomas mentioned in this Dispensa who is listed as the brother of Nicolasa Michel:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1942-29495-12880-93?cc=1937239&wc=M287-W3X:236973901
Therefore the son of Francisco Michel and Juana Betancur-Ruiz? Is this the same Tomas married to Agustina Vargas y Escobar and as you say Francisco may have been also married to Luisa de Guzman? as well as Agustina; or is this an entirely different Tomas? May we ask you your source? I personally don't have Luisa de Guzman in my tree and couldn't locate anything about her.

I also have Thomas Michel married to Juana Josefa Uribe, son of Francisco Michel Ordones and Manuela Lopez Bueso Betancur. I have Thomas, son of Thomas and Agustina Vargas y Escobar. Also, later in time, Thomas Michel married to Josefa Cobarrubias also Thomas Michel married to Antonia Cobarrubias.

I'm frustrated, but together we will surely find success in sorting out this puzzle.

Thank you,
Deedra Corona

Hi Deedra,

I am not a direct descendant of either Francisco Michel Ordones, but the Lopez Bueso line plays a major role in my genealogy. I too had pains trying to sort out these 2 couples, but maybe I can help slow the swirl.
Michaela Lopez Bueso was married to your Francisco Michel Ordones (1). She was the daughter of Nicolas Lopez Bueso and Nicolasa Guerrero de Ocon. She was born February 1661 in Sayula and died April 15, 1719 in Tecolotlan. Children are as follows:
1. Juana Michel Lopez Bueso married to Felix de Fonseca Feb 5, 1704 in Tecolotlan. Felix de Fonseca was the son of Juan de Fonseca and Juana Contreras.
2. Maria Michel Lopez Bueso born 1689 in Tuxcacuesco, married Pedro Ramirez Dec 14, 1711 in Tecolotlan. Pedro Ramirez born 1683 in Sayula was the son of Pedro Ramirez and Damiana de Castaneda.
3. Asencio Michel born 1692 in Tecolotlan.
4. Domingo Michel born 1693 in Tuxcacuesco.
5. Regina Michel born 1696 in Tecolotlan, married Pedro Nicolas Uribe May 9, 1728 in Tecolotlan. Pedro Nicolas Uribe was the son of Tomas de Uribe and Maria Estefania Aguilar y Araysa. He was born 1696 in Tecolotlan and later married Maria Magdalena de Arysa y Santana Jan 24, 1733 in Ejutla and Gertrudis Cobarrubias July 15, 1735 in Tecolotlan before he died Nov 5, 1749.
6. Dominga Michel born 1699 in Tecolotlan and died July 20, 1744 in Tecolotlan. She married Joseph de la Encarnacion y Gomez Feb 2, 1725 in Tecolotlan. Joseph Encarnacion y Gomez was the son Pedro Gomez Garcia and Maria de Contreras.

Manuela Lopez Bueso who was married to Francisco Michel Ordones (2) was born 1699 in Tecolotlan and died June 2, 1742 in Sayula. She was the daughter of Gaspar Lopez Bueso and Maria Sanchez Cabezuelas. Gaspar Lopez Bueso was the son of Nicolas Lopez Bueso and Nicolas Guerrero de Ocon (parents of Michaela Lopez Bueso married to Francisco Michel (1)). Children for Manuela Lopez Bueso and Francisco Michel are as follows:
1. Justa Michel married to Lorenzo Preciado Feb 5, 1742 in Sayula. Lorenzo Preciado was the son of Nicolas Preciado and Antonia Figueroa de Medina.
2. Maria Michel married Agustin Preciado Apr 30, 1739 in Tuxcacuesco. Agustin Preciado was the son of Nicolas Preciado and Antonia Figueroa de Medina.
3. Ygnacio Michel born 1718 in Tecolotlan, married Michaela Preciado, daughter of Nicolas Preciado and Antonia Figueroa de Medina. (See a pattern?)
4. Maria de la Concepcion Michel born 1719 in Tecolotlan.
5. Barbara Michel born 1722 in Tecolotlan, married Juan Antonio Preciado Feb 26, 1743. Juan Antonio Preciado was the son of Antonio Preciado and Michaela Gonzalez Lozano.
6. Antonia Lugarda Michel born 1726 in Tuxcacuesco.
7. Maria Lucia Michel born 1727 in Tuxcacuesco, married Bernardo Javier Hernandez Aug 23, 1744 in Sayula. Bernardo Javier Hernandez was the son of Nicolas Hernandez and Mariana Salvatierra.
8. Juan Mathias Francisco Michel born 1729 in Tuxcacuesco, married Maria Hilaria Preciado who was the daughter of Nicolas Preciado and Antonia Figueroa de Medina. Hilaria died in 1780 and Juan Mathias remarried Maria Ygnacia Cobarrubias on July 24, 1780 in Ejutla. Ygnacia Cobarrubias was the daughter of Francisco Cobarrubias and Feliciana Santana.
9. Antonio Feliciano Michel, often noted as Felix or Felis, was born 1730 in Tuxcacuesco. He married Maria Augustina Vasquez, daughter of Joseph Vasquez and Maria Antonia Preciado.
10. Thomas Michel born 1732 in Tuxcacuesco and died June 19, 1787. He married Juana Josepha Uribe, daughter of Pedro Nicolas Uribe and Gertrudis Cobarrubias.
11. Francisca Javiera de la Merced Michel was born 1734 in Tuxcacuesco.

I do have a record that Franciso Michel Ordones (2) married a second time to Lorenza Gertrudis Gonzalez but I have only one child that I added to my tree, Maria Magdalena Michel.

I did notice that you have Ygnacio Michel as the son of Michaela Lopez Bueso but his baptism record in 1718 shows the mother as Manuela Lopez Bueso (Michaela died 1719 at age 58).
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18721-65621-29?cc=1874591&wc=SS5Q-92S:173069801,173069802,173069803

Good luck,

Juan Jimenez

Hi Gil,

I think your reading the the baptism for María de Navarrete

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18561-23053-11?cc=1874591&wc=SSLN-3TL:171935101,171935102,171935103

is correct that María de Navarrete is the sister of Fernando/Hernando de Navarrete Corona. The parents are Luis de Nabarrete (sic.) and Lucía/Luisa Corona

Cheers,

Sergio Salés

Hi Juan,

What is your source for Maria Augustina Vasquez's parents? I have been looking for that and haven't found it...

Thanks!

Sergio

Dear Deedra, Enrique, Gil and Juan,

Here are some more clues on the Michel family:
There were at least three distinct Francisco Michel :
To respect Deedra’s designation, Francisco (1) Michel, died 1709. Francisco (2) Michel was born 1694, and died after 1744. So the third Francisco actually came before the other two, so we will call him “0”. I just re-wrote to Alfredo Ignacio Peña, who kindly gave me the image of the 1609 baptism in Guadalajara. It was also Alfredo who told me that Francisco (0) was married twice to see if he had the marriage documents. He says he is about to publish a book on the Michel involvement in the Cristero wars that it will include the genealogy. But he also says he will send me the documents he has when he gets a chance. So, I will wait for more on that. So IF, and only if we can prove that Francisco (0) is the son of Juan Michel and Graciana (by finding those marriages, THEN, here is the image of the baptism of Francisco (0):
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18621-66712-40?cc=1874591&wc=M99L-KF4:1126862010

Now, as stated above I have that Francisco (0) was married TWO times, the first time to Juana de Betancourt Ruiz (or Ruiz de Betancour), and the second time to Luisa de Guzmán.

First Marriage:
Proof of the first marriage can be seen from Salvador Michel’s marriage to Maria de la Rosa Lopez Bueso in 1688, where Salvador was the son of Francisco Michel and Juana de Vetancor (sic. Betancour). Importantly, both Francisco and Juana are listed as “difuntos,” meaning that they had died. That also lends some credence to the 1609 birth date. It also means that Salvador had to be at least 18-20 years old.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18715-13486-33?cc=1874591&wc=12509487
If Francisco (0) died before 1688, that means that the Francisco Michel (1) that died in 1709, husband of Michaela Lopez Bueso, HAD to be a different one. Given the similarity of names, I agree with you Deedra, that he (1) was probably the son (maybe even the firstborn) of Francisco Michel (0) and Juana de Betancourt. But we can’t prove it for sure yet. The death record for Francisco (1) does say though that he made a will, so finding that will would be worth more to us than however much he left to his heirs!!
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18721-8269-65?cc=1874591&wc=12508902

So, to recap on Francisco (0)’s children by his first wife, Juana de Betancourt
- Salvador Michel-Ordoñez (?-before 1708), married to Maria Rosa Lopez Bueso.
Children NOT proven, but suspected:
- Francisco (1) Michel (?-1709), married to Michaela Lopez Bueso (?-1719).

Second Marriage:
As to Francisco (0) Michel’s second marriage to Luisa de Guzmán, the following baptism names the father as “Juan Michel,” rather than Francisco. Some would say Francisco (0) was called “Juan Francisco,” but I would say we need MORE documents, and cannot say Francisco and Juan are the same person. But in any case, Luisa de Guzman DID exist.
- Antonio Michel, baptized 13 Jun 1679 in Autlan, and of whom I do not know more.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18561-21218-98?cc=1874591&wc=SSLN-3TL:171935101,171935102,171935103

Children NOT proven by document, but suspected
- Tomas Michel (d. before 1702), married to Augustina de Vargas-Machuca y Ruiz de Escobar

Now, regarding Juana de Betancur:
There were probably at least two women named this. The first is the first wife of Francisco (0) Michel, which can be seen with Salvador Michel’s marriage listed above. But I do not have more concrete information for her. The reason I think she was the first wife is because otherwise both Juanas would be contemporaneous and married to two different men.
The second Juana de Betancor was the wife of Hernán/Fernán González-Corona (ca. 1662-after 1668). They had the following children:
- Graciana Corona (baptized 10 Sep 1662), married to Joseph Lopez de Andrade on 6 Jun 1677 in Autlan.
Baptism, says Juana was “legitima mujer” of Hernan Gonzalez, meaning his legitimate wife.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18561-21829-37?cc=1874591&wc=9LXZ-MNL:171935101,171935102,171935103
- Juana, baptized 7 Apr 1665 in Autlan
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18561-21896-30?cc=1874591&wc=9LXZ-MNL:171935101,171935102,171935103
- Francisca, baptized in Autlan 11 Oct 1666 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18561-21786-31?cc=1874591&wc=9LXZ-MNL:171935101,171935102,171935103 she later married Francisco Madrueño Gonzalez and had a number of children
- Nicolas (of whom there are many in Autlan), baptized 14 Feb 1668 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18561-21698-58?cc=1874591&wc=SSLN-3TL:171935101,171935102,171935103 Interestingly, the godfather is Gaspar Michel, of whom I have no more information.
There is a Juana de Batancor who died in Autlan on 20 Nov 1706. Given that Salvador Michel’s marriage in 1688 said his mother Juana had died before then, this must be a different Juana, and thus probably the widow of Hernan Gonzalez Corona. Also, it says “el novenario que pago su yerno Fran.co Madrueño,” which would make sense if he is the husband of Francisca (see above).
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18531-30925-97?cc=1874591&wc=SSL7-HZ9:171935101,171935102,172619201
And a last word on Domingo Michel:
Domingo Michel, son of Francisco (1) and Michaela Lopez Bueso, died 21 Apr 1730 in Tecolotlan. Thanks to Juan’s post, I was able to connect a random Domingo Michel I had in my files to this family. Notice how in the death record it says that “se le dijeron quarto missas resadas que dio la limosna Pedro Ramíres.” That makes sense if Pedro Ramírez is Domingo’s brother-in-law, married to his sister María Michel on 14 Dec 1711 in Tecolotlan. Here is Domingo’s death record:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18562-9072-60?cc=1874591&wc=M99L-8WV:n639943481

Hope this helps!

Sergio Salés

HI Sergio,

Thanks for all the info on the the three Francisco Michels and Thomas Michel. I too have all 4 of these Michels in my tree but cannot make the connection between them. Your reasoning makes total sense and hypothesis seems likely true.

You also asked about the source of Maria Augustina Vasquez's parents. The source is a marriage dispensation for Pedro Michel and Ana Maria Corona who married Feb 25, 1811 in Ejutla.
Their marriage record can be found here:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18567-5274-10?cc=1874591&wc=SSLB-L29:171936101,171934002,173052001
And their dispensa can be found here:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18426-92276-43?cc=1874591&wc=SS23-YWL:171935001,171974101,1085609302
Their dispensa contains two family trees. One shows the descendants of our Francisco Michel (2) who was married to Manuela Lopez Bueso. The second tree shows the descendants of Jose Vasquez. From these 2 trees you can make at least a couple of deductions. The first that Felis Michel was married to Agustina Vasquez because the trees show that they were the parents of Jose Maria Michel.
The second deduction is that Agustina Vasquez was the sister of Jose Maria Vasquez and their father was Jose Vasquez. Jose Maria Vasquez was married to Maria Valeria Michel. They married Jan 10, 1776 in Tuxcacuesco. According to their marriage record found here: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18735-65911-14?cc=1874591&wc=SS58-16D:173457201,171935202,174360401, Jose Maria Vasquez was the son of Jose Vasquez and Maria Antonia Preciado. Valeria Michel was the daughter of Thomas Michel and Juana Josepha Uribe. (Thomas Michel was the son of Franciso Michel (2)). Therefore Agustina Vasquez was the daughter of Jose Vasquez and Maria Antonia Preciado. (Maria Antonia Preciado was the daughter of Nicolas Preciado and Antonia Figueroa de Medina.)
I don't have much info on Jose Vasquez. But I do have that he had at least 4 children with Maria Antonia Preciado:
1. Jose Maria Vasquez who as mentioned above was married to Valeria Michel.
2. Jose Vasquez married to Rosa Garcia de Alba on Sept 25, 1762 in Ejutla. Rosa Garcia de Alba was the daughter of Juan Manuel Garcia de Alba and Juana de Santana.
3. Juan Antonia Vasquez who married Dionicia Garcia de Alba April 14, 1766 in Ejutla. Dionicia Garcia de Alba was the daughter of Juan Manuel Garcia de Alba and Juana de Santana.
4. Maria Augustina Vasquez who as mentioned above was married to Antonio Feliciano Michel.

By the way, I have a Gaspar Michel that married Maria Cobarrubias de Escobar July 6, 1683 in Ciudad Guzman. The record mentions that he is from Tecolotlan, but no mention of his parents. The parents of Maria Cobarrubias were Antonio de Cobarrubias and Maria de Escobar. Here is the link: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18457-64981-61?cc=1874591&wc=SSL9-YWP:171935501,172237202,175751301

Hope this helps you. Happy Thanksgiving!

Juan Jimenez

I have Michel way back in my lines and haven’t gotten around to researching them in depth, so this seems a good place to air out what I have.

Besides the few documents I’ve found, the only lead I have for this line is from a previous Nuestros Ranchos thread, which gives the origin: http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/en/node/19058

In my lines I have Micaela Michel Ordoñez aka Micaela Corona, baptized 29 Sep 1602 in Guadalajara; daughter of Juan Michel Ordoñez and Graciana Corona, her padrino was Gabriel Ordoñez (who I assume is her uncle). She married Juan Cortes Mudarra 3 Feb 1625 in Guadalajara; they moved to Charcas, SLP in summer of 1633; Micaela (Corona) was buried 26 May 1680, in Charcas, SLP.

I have her father, Juan Michel Ordoñez, as the son of Cristobal Ordoñez and Francisca Ruiz Farache - I am seeking documentation for this link. I don’t know who Graciana Corona’s parents are - would any of you have her pedigree?

In addition to Micaela, I have Juan Michel and Graciana Corona with two more children:
Juan Michel Ordoñez, b. 11 Jul 1607, Guadalajara; m. Juana Betancourt Ruiz
Francisco Michel Ordoñez, b. 12 May 1609, Guadalajara, m. Luisa de Guzman.

There is a marriage record for Melchor Espinosa married to Jusepa de Torrequemada (sic Torquemada?), 09 Jun 1602. The notary wrote “hiija de Gabriel digo Cristobal Ordoñez.”
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JCDK-8JY
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18621-67202-13?cc=1874591&wc=MCCG-8NL:171935001,182938601,182938602

Melchor Espinosa and Juana Torrequemada had 2 children that I know of; on their baptism records, she uses the surname “Rifarache”:
Juan Espinosa-Rifarache, b. 13 May 1603, Guadalajara.
Manuel Espinosa-Rifarache, b. 15 May 1614, Guadalajara.

My question is: is Jusepa de Torrequemada aka Jusepa Rifarache a daughter of Cristobal Ordoñez and Francisca Ruiz Farache? And if so, what is the link to Torrequemada?

Thank you in advance for any assistance.
Saludos,

Manny Diez Hermosillo
http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/jrefugioghermosillo

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