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Nayarit

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By makas_nc - Posted on 28 August 2014

An applicant to the group says this:

"La Yesca municipality in Nayarit which was a part of Jalisco in the 19th
century"

Can someone please send me a list of places that historically were part of
Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes but are in other states now?

Thanks for your help

Joseph

Joseph Puentes

Clean@h2opodcast.com

http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html

I don't know about other states, but regarding Nayarit, it was part of the state of Jalisco and before that Nueva Galicia for centuries. It became a separate state less than 100 years ago, on January 26, 1917. Colima was also part of Jalisco, but became a state back in the 19th century.

A couple of years ago I worked on the family tree of some friends of mine from Tepatitlan Jalisco by the last name of Franco (Victorio Franco)I thought that they would hook up with the Franco's in one of my grandparents branches as three of my grandparents have Franco ancestry. It turns out that these Franco's from Tepatitlan surprised me with a connection to Nayarit. It seems some of the members of the family traveled back and forth between Tepatitlan and Nayarit, leaving family in both areas in the 19th and 20th centuries.

R.A.Ricci

Joseph,
What we know today as Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes did not exist during colonial times. The ideology of political divisions known as states was introduced well after the Mexican independence. For example, the state of Aguascalientes was incorporated into the "Intendencia de Zacatecas," Jalisco was known as "Intendencia de Guadalajara," etc. These new political divisions were a result of the many "Reformas Borbónicas" of the late XVIII century.
The "Reinos" under the Habsburg (Reino de Nueva Galicia, Nuevo León, Méjico, etc.) consisted of Alcaldía Mayores which were replaced with the Borbón Intendencias, later replaced with "Departamentos" under Agustín I up to Maximilian I. Mexico eventually adopted modernizing into the United States of Mexico. Something that many people are not aware is that the Alcaldía Mayores and Intendencias had provinces within them, political sub-divisions if you will. Some of the ones that pertain to our area were the Alcaldía Mayor de Aguascalientes and Xuchipila. A well known province of that day was "La provincia de Avalos.
Hope this sheds some light,
Daniel Méndez de Torres Camino

Joseph,

Originally, in the early colonial days of Nueva España, the Nueva Galicia
region, encompassed the current day states of Nayarit, Colima,, Jalisco,
Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.

Alicia

On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:

>
>
> An applicant to the group says this:
>
>
>
> "La Yesca municipality in Nayarit which was a part of Jalisco in the 19th
> century"
>
>
>
> Can someone please send me a list of places that historically were part of
> Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes but are in other states now?
>
>
>
> Thanks for your help
>
>
>
> Joseph
>
>
>
>
>
> Joseph Puentes
>
> Clean@h2opodcast.com
>
> http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
>
>
>
>
>

Alicia and Joseph

I think the changing of borders in Mexico is the reason we find ancestors living in one state for generations, then they disappear as if they fell off the end of the earth. Family Search lists people in the cities and states as they are known now. I find this problem in the US Census, too. I follow people from 1792 to when the states split apart or were combined, so it looks like they lived in one county for generations, then seem to disappear, but if I am lucky, I find them in another state or county with the same address. They never moved---the borders moved, and Ancestry and Family Search can only list the counties/states as they are known now, right? It would take several books, not lists, to update us, no?

Emilie
Port Orchard, WA

----------------------------------------------------------------
> Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2014 13:13:13 -0700
> From: allieavelar@gmail.com
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.com
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Nayarit
>
> Joseph,
>
> Originally, in the early colonial days of Nueva España, the Nueva Galicia
> region, encompassed the current day states of Nayarit, Colima,, Jalisco,
> Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.
>
> Alicia
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > An applicant to the group says this:
> >
> >
> >
> > "La Yesca municipality in Nayarit which was a part of Jalisco in the 19th
> > century"
> >
> >
> >
> > Can someone please send me a list of places that historically were part of
> > Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes but are in other states now?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for your help
> >
> >
> >
> > Joseph
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Joseph Puentes
> >
> > Clean@h2opodcast.com
> >
> > http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> >

According to the book by Ida Altman, "The War For Mexico's West" the
original town of "Xalisco" was within a league of Tepic, which is the
current capital of Nayarit. The two communities originally belonged to two
different ethnic groups of native Americans. In 1525 when the Spanish
arrived, Francisco Cortes and his men indicated that the town was one of
the larger communities in the region. They recorded that it had 400 homes
and 800 men and they did not trade with other communities. Tepic which was
located by a river and closer to the coast had about half the population of
Xalisco and the two communities were known to wage wars against each other.

Just a little pre-colonial history.

Alicia

On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 4:20 PM, Emilie Garcia
wrote:

> Alicia and Joseph
>
> I think the changing of borders in Mexico is the reason we find ancestors
> living in one state for generations, then they disappear as if they fell
> off the end of the earth. Family Search lists people in the cities and
> states as they are known now. I find this problem in the US Census, too.
> I follow people from 1792 to when the states split apart or were combined,
> so it looks like they lived in one county for generations, then seem to
> disappear, but if I am lucky, I find them in another state or county with
> the same address. They never moved---the borders moved, and Ancestry and
> Family Search can only list the counties/states as they are known now,
> right? It would take several books, not lists, to update us, no?
>
> Emilie
> Port Orchard, WA
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> > Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2014 13:13:13 -0700
> > From: allieavelar@gmail.com
> > To: research@nuestrosranchos.com
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Nayarit
> >
> > Joseph,
> >
> > Originally, in the early colonial days of Nueva España, the Nueva Galicia
> > region, encompassed the current day states of Nayarit, Colima,, Jalisco,
> > Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.
> >
> > Alicia
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > An applicant to the group says this:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "La Yesca municipality in Nayarit which was a part of Jalisco in the
> 19th
> > > century"
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Can someone please send me a list of places that historically were
> part of
> > > Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes but are in other states now?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks for your help
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Joseph
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Joseph Puentes
> > >
> > > Clean@h2opodcast.com
> > >
> > > http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> > >
> > > To post, send email to:
> > > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> > >
> > > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> > >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
>

Joseph,

What the applicant says is true.

Mexico's 19th century history is complicated because it was a long conflict between federalists and centralizers,but it was a federal republic from 1824-1835.

During the first Mexican Federal Republic of 1824, there were 18 free and sovereign states ("estados libres y soberanos"). "Jalisco" was one of those states, and consisted of what today are the states of Jalisco and Nayarit.

The text of the Constitution (is only 12 pages and is interesting to read!)is here:
http://www.ordenjuridico.gob.mx/Constitucion/1824A.pdf

Article 7 spells out which states would a part of the nation. As Daniel said, there were a number of states (three to be exact) that had provinces in them, that later became free states in their own right. The three states were called Estado Interno de Oriente, Estado Interno del Norte and Estado Interno de Oriente. But Jalisco was not one of those. It was simply called Jalisco.
You can see the map here:
http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acta_Constitutiva_de_la_Federaci%C3%B3n_Mexicana

The central government of 1835 then went on to end the Federal Republic with the "Siete Leyes" which abolished the states' freedoms and turned the states into departments with appointed rather than elected governors. That's when Texas fought for its independence, and it did so under the banner of the 1824 Constitution. (Of course before the war the government backed down and tried to make a Texan exception, but it was too late). But even then Jalisco and Nayarit were one entity.

In fact, Nayarit did not become an independent state until 1 May 1917, under the current Federal Constitution.
http://proleg.congresonay.gob.mx/seccion/nayarit_historia.php

So, the applicant is correct, Nayarit was part of Jalisco during the 19th century...

Sergio Salés

Alicia,

I appreciate your comments. My father was born in the state of Nayarit.

Paul J Gomez
Sent from my iPad

> On Aug 29, 2014, at 5:23 PM, Alicia Carrillo wrote:
>
> According to the book by Ida Altman, "The War For Mexico's West" the
> original town of "Xalisco" was within a league of Tepic, which is the
> current capital of Nayarit. The two communities originally belonged to two
> different ethnic groups of native Americans. In 1525 when the Spanish
> arrived, Francisco Cortes and his men indicated that the town was one of
> the larger communities in the region. They recorded that it had 400 homes
> and 800 men and they did not trade with other communities. Tepic which was
> located by a river and closer to the coast had about half the population of
> Xalisco and the two communities were known to wage wars against each other.
>
> Just a little pre-colonial history.
>
> Alicia
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 4:20 PM, Emilie Garcia
> wrote:
>
>> Alicia and Joseph
>>
>> I think the changing of borders in Mexico is the reason we find ancestors
>> living in one state for generations, then they disappear as if they fell
>> off the end of the earth. Family Search lists people in the cities and
>> states as they are known now. I find this problem in the US Census, too.
>> I follow people from 1792 to when the states split apart or were combined,
>> so it looks like they lived in one county for generations, then seem to
>> disappear, but if I am lucky, I find them in another state or county with
>> the same address. They never moved---the borders moved, and Ancestry and
>> Family Search can only list the counties/states as they are known now,
>> right? It would take several books, not lists, to update us, no?
>>
>> Emilie
>> Port Orchard, WA
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2014 13:13:13 -0700
>>> From: allieavelar@gmail.com
>>> To: research@nuestrosranchos.com
>>> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Nayarit
>>>
>>> Joseph,
>>>
>>> Originally, in the early colonial days of Nueva España, the Nueva Galicia
>>> region, encompassed the current day states of Nayarit, Colima,, Jalisco,
>>> Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.
>>>
>>> Alicia
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> An applicant to the group says this:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "La Yesca municipality in Nayarit which was a part of Jalisco in the
>> 19th
>>>> century"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Can someone please send me a list of places that historically were
>> part of
>>>> Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes but are in other states now?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for your help
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Joseph
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Joseph Puentes
>>>>
>>>> Clean@h2opodcast.com
>>>>
>>>> http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
>>>> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
>>>>
>>>> To post, send email to:
>>>> research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
>>>>
>>>> To change your subscription, log on to:
>>>> http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
>>> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
>>> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
>>>
>>> To post, send email to:
>>> research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
>>>
>>> To change your subscription, log on to:
>>> http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
>>

You're welcome Paul,

They're not actually my comments, they come from history books that I have.
I love reading about history, but especially about my history, whether
Mexico, USA and Europe, somehow I feel very grounded and connected with
history.

Alicia

On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 8:12 PM, Paul J Gomez
wrote:

> Alicia,
>
> I appreciate your comments. My father was born in the state of Nayarit.
>
> Paul J Gomez
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On Aug 29, 2014, at 5:23 PM, Alicia Carrillo
> wrote:
> >
> > According to the book by Ida Altman, "The War For Mexico's West" the
> > original town of "Xalisco" was within a league of Tepic, which is the
> > current capital of Nayarit. The two communities originally belonged to
> two
> > different ethnic groups of native Americans. In 1525 when the Spanish
> > arrived, Francisco Cortes and his men indicated that the town was one of
> > the larger communities in the region. They recorded that it had 400 homes
> > and 800 men and they did not trade with other communities. Tepic which
> was
> > located by a river and closer to the coast had about half the population
> of
> > Xalisco and the two communities were known to wage wars against each
> other.
> >
> > Just a little pre-colonial history.
> >
> > Alicia
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 4:20 PM, Emilie Garcia <
> auntyemfaustus@hotmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Alicia and Joseph
> >>
> >> I think the changing of borders in Mexico is the reason we find
> ancestors
> >> living in one state for generations, then they disappear as if they fell
> >> off the end of the earth. Family Search lists people in the cities and
> >> states as they are known now. I find this problem in the US Census,
> too.
> >> I follow people from 1792 to when the states split apart or were
> combined,
> >> so it looks like they lived in one county for generations, then seem to
> >> disappear, but if I am lucky, I find them in another state or county
> with
> >> the same address. They never moved---the borders moved, and Ancestry
> and
> >> Family Search can only list the counties/states as they are known now,
> >> right? It would take several books, not lists, to update us, no?
> >>
> >> Emilie
> >> Port Orchard, WA
> >>
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2014 13:13:13 -0700
> >>> From: allieavelar@gmail.com
> >>> To: research@nuestrosranchos.com
> >>> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Nayarit
> >>>
> >>> Joseph,
> >>>
> >>> Originally, in the early colonial days of Nueva España, the Nueva
> Galicia
> >>> region, encompassed the current day states of Nayarit, Colima,,
> Jalisco,
> >>> Zacatecas and Aguascalientes.
> >>>
> >>> Alicia
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Joseph Puentes
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> An applicant to the group says this:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> "La Yesca municipality in Nayarit which was a part of Jalisco in the
> >> 19th
> >>>> century"
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Can someone please send me a list of places that historically were
> >> part of
> >>>> Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes but are in other states now?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks for your help
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Joseph
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Joseph Puentes
> >>>>
> >>>> Clean@h2opodcast.com
> >>>>
> >>>> http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> >>>> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >>>>
> >>>> To post, send email to:
> >>>> research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >>>>
> >>>> To change your subscription, log on to:
> >>>> http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> >>> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> >>> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >>>
> >>> To post, send email to:
> >>> research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >>>
> >>> To change your subscription, log on to:
> >>> http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> >>
> >> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> >> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >>
> >> To post, send email to:
> >> research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >>
> >> To change your subscription, log on to:
> >> http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)NuestrosRanchos.com
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.NuestrosRanchos.com

Me too.

Paul J Gomez
Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 29, 2014, at 8:26 PM, Alicia Carrillo wrote:
>
> You're welcome Paul,
>
> They're not actually my comments, they come from history books that I have.
> I love reading about history, but especially about my history, whether
> Mexico, USA and Europe, somehow I feel very grounded and connected with
> history.
>
> Alicia
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 8:12 PM, Paul J Gomez
> wrote:
>
>> Alicia,
>>
>> I appreciate your comments. My father was born in the state of Nayarit.
>>
>> Paul J Gomez
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>>> On Aug 29, 2014, at 5:23 PM, Alicia Carrillo
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> According to the book by Ida Altman, "The War For Mexico's West" the
>>> original town of "Xalisco" was within a league of Tepic, which is the
>>> current capital of Nayarit. The two communities originally belonged to
>> two
>>> different ethnic groups of native Americans. In 1525 when the Spanish
>>> arrived, Francisco Cortes and his men indicated that the town was one of
>>> the larger communities in the region. They recorded that it had 400 homes
>>> and 800 men and they did not trade with other communities. Tepic which
>> was
>>> located by a river and closer to the coast had about half the population
>> of
>>> Xalisco and the two communities were known to wage wars against each
>> other.
>>>
>>> Just a little pre-colonial history.
>>>
>>> Alicia
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 4:20 PM, Emilie Garcia <
>> auntyemfaustus@hotmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Alicia and Joseph
>>>>
>>>> I think the changing of borders in Mexico is the reason we find
>> ancestors
>>>> living in one state for generations, then they disappear as if they fell
>>>> off the end of the earth. Family Search lists people in the cities and
>>>> states as they are known now. I find this problem in the US Census,
>> too.
>>>> I follow people from 1792 to when the states split apart or were
>> combined,
>>>> so it looks like they lived in one county for generations, then seem to
>>>> disappear, but if I am lucky, I find them in another state or county
>> with
>>>> the same address. They never moved---the borders moved, and Ancestry
>> and
>>>> Family Search can only list the counties/states as they are known now,
>>>> right? It would take several books, not lists, to update us, no?
>>>>
>>>> Emilie
>>>> Port Orchard, WA

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