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Need help from the experts on how to read the surnames on this marriage information

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By Anna Miklovic - Posted on 14 June 2012

The following is what I received from one of the California Missions of my ancestors on their marriage:

On May25th, 1859 Francisco Carrizosa 34, native of Tujuta Son. residing in el Rancho of San Jose, widower of Jesus Celaya of Jose & Pabla (Paula) Gastelo with Micaela Manzanero, 36 widow of Franco. Bustamante also of sonora of Pedro & Concepcion Ortiz, living in S. Jose, Ramon Andrade & Maria del Carmen Guillen witness.

I am not sure who Jose & Paula Gastelo are related to. Are they the parents to Francisco Carrisosa or to Jesus Celaya? The other question is, is the surname Gastelo the maiden name to Paula and assuming Jose's surname is Carrisosa or Celaya? I have the same questions for Pedro & Concepcion Ortiz.

Thank you. Anna Miklovic

The way the information is written doesn't make much sense. Probably it is an uncomplete transcription.

I have seen baptism records where they don't write the surname of the grandfather (just the given name) but they write the full name of the grandmother. I think they used to do this since it was obvious that the surname of the grandfather was the same as the one of his child.

There was not such thing as a maiden name, women would keep their birth-name after marrying. They still do.

When a widow would get married, they usually did not write the names of his parents, just the name of his late wife. The same was true for the widows.

I think Jesus Celaya was a female, named either Jesusa or Maria de Jesus.

The way it was transcribed, Jose & Pabla (Paula) Gastelo could be the parents of either the widower or of his late wife. It is hard to guess. Same for Pedro & Concepcion Ortiz. Maybe if you had an image of the original document it would be easier to figure this out.

Best regards,

Victoriano Navarro

Thank you for your answers and suggestions. It's been frustrating trying to find out what California Mission has what records on file and when I find the right Mission, I receive something like this. For example, my ancestors married at the San Gabriel Mission in 1859 but the San Fernando Mission is the one that has their records on file; not San Gabriel nor Santa Barbara Mission as they are listed on the Missions' website to contact them for the old records. My next step is to go through the city (Los Angeles) requesting a copy of their marriage record.

Thanks again for your response. Anna Miklovic

On Jun 14, 2012, at 7:54 PM, mnavarrovillalobos@yahoo.com.mx wrote:

> The way the information is written doesn't make much sense. Probably it is an uncomplete transcription.
>
> I have seen baptism records where they don't write the surname of the grandfather (just the given name) but they write the full name of the grandmother. I think they used to do this since it was obvious that the surname of the grandfather was the same as the one of his child.
> There was not such thing as a maiden name, women would keep their birth-name after marrying. They still do.
> When a widow would get married, they usually did not write the names of his parents, just the name of his late wife. The same was true for the widows.
>
> I think Jesus Celaya was a female, named either Jesusa or Maria de Jesus.
>
> The way it was transcribed, Jose & Pabla (Paula) Gastelo could be the parents of either the widower or of his late wife. It is hard to guess. Same for Pedro & Concepcion Ortiz. Maybe if you had an image of the original document it would be easier to figure this out.
>
> Best regards,
> Victoriano Navarro

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