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Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241

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By Pat Silva Corbera - Posted on 24 February 2012

List Members,

 

I would appreciate help in translating the side bar information on this marriage record...

Image 33 of 241 ... there appears a date possibly of 25 Jan 1682 on this marriage record dated 22 Apr 1680 for Machairo de Espitia and Simona de Silva...

 

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-12446-30363-60?cc=1410092&wc=6810680

 

I have located bapt records with his couple being noted as the parents, but only the above noted marriage record.

 

There is also a death/burial record for Simona De Silva buried 17 Aug 1719 ...

 

All records are for Aguascalientes...

 

Thank you,

Pat Silva Corbera

 

 

 

 

Pat,

Macario de Espitia and Simona de Silva were married 22 April 1680 in
Aguascalientes. The marginal note says they were veiled (se velaron) almost
two years later 25 Jan 1682. Macario de Espitia was buried in
Aguascalientes 1 May 1732. I have identified six children for this couple:
Isabel, Michaela, Andrés, Jacinto, Salvador and María Teresa de Espitia.
Where can I find the baptismal record of Simona de Silva?

BILL FIGUEROA

Bill,

 

Thank you...what is to be "vailed" ? Would that "vailing ceremony," have a vailing/marriage record online?  This term is unfamiliar to me.

 

I have located the following children hoping that their AP and AM would be mentioned, but they were not...

 

I have Michaela, Ysabel, Andres and Salvador.  I will search for Jacinto and Maria Teresa. that you mentioned.

 

Simona's burial record date is 17 Aug 1719...I didn't have Macario's burial date, I'll look that up.

 

To date I have not located birth/bapt records for either Macario or Simona.

 

I learned of their names from their daughter Ysabel's bapt record.  Ysabel is my husband's 5th greatgrandmother who is married to Diego de Aguayo/Aguallo (m.12 Jan 1699 Nochistlan).

 

Are you linked to this family?

 

Thank you,

Pat Silva Corbera 

 
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Figueroa"
To: research@NuestrosRanchos.com
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 12:38:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241

Pat,

Macario de Espitia and Simona de Silva were married 22 April 1680 in
Aguascalientes.  The marginal note says they were veiled (se velaron) almost
two years later 25 Jan 1682.  Macario de Espitia was buried in
Aguascalientes 1 May 1732.  I have identified six children for this couple:
Isabel, Michaela, Andrés, Jacinto, Salvador and María Teresa de Espitia.
Where can I find the baptismal record of Simona de Silva?

BILL FIGUEROA

Pat,

I hope you don't me answering for Bill. Here are a few links to get you
acquainted with the ceremony.

http://hispanic-ancestors.blogspot.com/2012/02/veiling-ceremony.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OicTTrozME

http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/en/node/16074

http://buscon.rae.es/draeI/SrvltConsulta?TIPO_BUS=3&LEMA=velar

Bill and Pat,

I also descend from Espitia/Aspitia. I finally understand why my ancestors
used so many surnames. Nicolás Macias Espitia and Ana Muñoz had children in
Lagos de Moreno between 1645 and 1664. Sometimes they used the surname
Torres. After looking at records in Aguascalientes I see Hernando de Torres
Espitia married Juana Vásquez Macias alias Juana Vasquez de Retamosa 11 Jan
1615 in Aguascalientes film 299421. This makes me think that my ancestor
was their son Nicolás Torres Vásquez baptized 2 May 1622 film 299421. Is
Macario de Espitia related to Hernando de Torres Espitia?

Armando

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 3:12 PM, Pat Corbera wrote:

>
>
> Bill,
>
>
>
> Thank you...what is to be "vailed" ? Would that "vailing ceremony," have a
> vailing/marriage record online? This term is unfamiliar to me.
>
>
>
> I have located the following children hoping that their AP and AM would be
> mentioned, but they were not...
>
>
>
> I have Michaela, Ysabel, Andres and Salvador. I will search for Jacinto
> and Maria Teresa. that you mentioned.
>
>
>
> Simona's burial record date is 17 Aug 1719...I didn't have Macario's
> burial date, I'll look that up.
>
>
>
> To date I have not located birth/bapt records for either Macario or Simona.
>
>
>
> I learned of their names from their daughter Ysabel's bapt record. Ysabel
> is my husband's 5th greatgrandmother who is married to Diego de
> Aguayo/Aguallo (m.12 Jan 1699 Nochistlan).
>
>
>
> Are you linked to this family?
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Pat Silva Corbera
>
>
>
>
>

Hi Armando,

 

 I always value your input, your comments are always welcomed.

 

As for Macario de Espitia being related to Hernando de Torres Espitia it's possible, but we need to located documents that reference/associate them with the various name combinations found in each family.

 

Tomorrow I'm going to try and locate the marriages of Macario and Simona's offspring...  I realize that even if I find their grandchildren, the reference, if any,  to  AP and/or AM will simply refer to Macario and Simona... it's the spouse connections that may lead to a different branch of Espitias/Munoz/Macias/Torres etc.families...possibly linking Macario and Hernando's families. I'll also check the time line...

 

Thank you for the links to the very informative information about "veiling. "  Very interesting.

 

Wonder why Macario and Simona's "veiling," took place about 2 years after their 1680 marriage...

 

If the church didn't recognize a marriage being "completed until the veiling," wonder if some priest would consider children bring born before the "veiling, " as being "hijos naturales."

 

Once again thank you ...

Pat Silva Corbera

Tracy CA

 

 
----- Original Message -----
From: "Armando"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.com
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 3:18:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241

Pat,

I hope you don't me answering for Bill. Here are a few links to get you
acquainted with the ceremony.

http://hispanic-ancestors.blogspot.com/2012/02/veiling-ceremony.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OicTTrozME

http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/en/node/16074

http://buscon.rae.es/draeI/SrvltConsulta?TIPO_BUS=3&LEMA=velar

Bill and Pat,

I also descend from Espitia/Aspitia. I finally understand why my ancestors
used so many surnames. Nicolás Macias Espitia and Ana Muñoz had children in
Lagos de Moreno between 1645 and 1664. Sometimes they used the surname
Torres. After looking at records in Aguascalientes I see Hernando de Torres
Espitia married Juana Vásquez Macias alias Juana Vasquez de Retamosa 11 Jan
1615 in Aguascalientes film 299421. This makes me think that my ancestor
was their son Nicolás Torres Vásquez baptized 2 May 1622 film 299421. Is
Macario de Espitia related to Hernando de Torres Espitia?

Armando

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 3:12 PM, Pat Corbera wrote:

>
>
> Bill,
>
>
>
> Thank you...what is to be "vailed" ? Would that "vailing ceremony," have a
> vailing/marriage record online?  This term is unfamiliar to me.
>
>
>
> I have located the following children hoping that their AP and AM would be
> mentioned, but they were not...
>
>
>
> I have Michaela, Ysabel, Andres and Salvador.  I will search for Jacinto
> and Maria Teresa. that you mentioned.
>
>
>
> Simona's burial record date is 17 Aug 1719...I didn't have Macario's
> burial date, I'll look that up.
>
>
>
> To date I have not located birth/bapt records for either Macario or Simona.
>
>
>
> I learned of their names from their daughter Ysabel's bapt record.  Ysabel
> is my husband's 5th greatgrandmother who is married to Diego de
> Aguayo/Aguallo (m.12 Jan 1699 Nochistlan).
>
>
>
> Are you linked to this family?
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Pat Silva Corbera
>
>
>
>
>

Thanks Armando for the links, they are all very informative, I never knew the true meaning of velados.

Alicia

________________________________
From: Armando
To: research@nuestrosranchos.com
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2012 3:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241

Pat,

I hope you don't me answering for Bill. Here are a few links to get you
acquainted with the ceremony.

http://hispanic-ancestors.blogspot.com/2012/02/veiling-ceremony.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OicTTrozME

http://www.nuestrosranchos.com/en/node/16074

http://buscon.rae.es/draeI/SrvltConsulta?TIPO_BUS=3&LEMA=velar

Bill and Pat,

I also descend from Espitia/Aspitia. I finally understand why my ancestors
used so many surnames. Nicolás Macias Espitia and Ana Muñoz had children in
Lagos de Moreno between 1645 and 1664. Sometimes they used the surname
Torres. After looking at records in Aguascalientes I see Hernando de Torres
Espitia married Juana Vásquez Macias alias Juana Vasquez de Retamosa 11 Jan
1615 in Aguascalientes film 299421. This makes me think that my ancestor
was their son Nicolás Torres Vásquez baptized 2 May 1622 film 299421. Is
Macario de Espitia related to Hernando de Torres Espitia?

Armando

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 3:12 PM, Pat Corbera wrote:

>
>
> Bill,
>
>
>
> Thank you...what is to be "vailed" ? Would that "vailing ceremony," have a
> vailing/marriage record online?  This term is unfamiliar to me.
>
>
>
> I have located the following children hoping that their AP and AM would be
> mentioned, but they were not...
>
>
>
> I have Michaela, Ysabel, Andres and Salvador.  I will search for Jacinto
> and Maria Teresa. that you mentioned.
>
>
>
> Simona's burial record date is 17 Aug 1719...I didn't have Macario's
> burial date, I'll look that up.
>
>
>
> To date I have not located birth/bapt records for either Macario or Simona.
>
>
>
> I learned of their names from their daughter Ysabel's bapt record.  Ysabel
> is my husband's 5th greatgrandmother who is married to Diego de
> Aguayo/Aguallo (m.12 Jan 1699 Nochistlan).
>
>
>
> Are you linked to this family?
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Pat Silva Corbera
>
>
>
>
>

Pat and Armando,

I think the links provided by Armando explain the veiling ceremony quite accurately. Most veilings in Aguascalientes were performed during the wedding ceremony (casados y velados) although in some instances the veiling ceremony was performed later (casados y no velados). As the marriage blessing was considered a celebration, it was not allowed during Advent and Lent (that are considered penance periods). Therefore, if the marriage was celebrated during these periods, a separate veiling ceremony (velación) was required to complete the marriage sacrament. That explains why sometimes marriage and veiling happened during the same day and sometimes on different dates. Most often the priest recorded the wedding and veiling ceremonies in the same book (Libro de Matrimonios) either as an annotation next to the wedding or as a separate record. I have not found any veilings recorded in separate parish books in Aguascalientes.

Macario de Espitia was baptized 21 Jan 1659 in Aguascalientes [ Film 0299421 Baptisms 1616-1660 Aguascalientes ] and buried 1 May 1732 [ Film 299856 Defunciones 1620-1752 Aguascalientes ]. He was the son of Bartolome de Espitia and Juana Gonzalez (aka Juana de la Cerda, Juana de Espinosa, Juana Lopez de Elizalde, Juana Gonzalez Lisardi). The parents of Bartolome de Espitia were Francisco de Espitia and Francisca de Quiroga.

Macario's son Jacinto de Espitia was born 6 Sep 1688 and baptized 18 Sep 1688 in Aguascalientes. His daughter Maria Teresa de Espitia was baptized 13 Aug 1697 also in Aguascalientes [ Film 299423 Baptisms 1684-1701 ]

I don't have any additional information about Simona de Silva except for her burial record, which you already have.

As far as Hernando de Torres Espitia is concerned, he was originally from Mexico City. He married Juana Vazquez de Retamosa (aka Juana Macías) from Los Gallos 11 Jan 1615 in Aguascalientes. This couple was veiled several years later on 17 Sep 1619 also in Aguascalientes. Their children Magdalena, Juan and Nicolas de Torres were all baptized in Aguascalientes in 1618, 1620 and 1622. I have not found any family link between Hernando de Torres Espitia and Macario de Espitia or his ancestors Bartolome (Macario's father) and Francisco de Espitia (his grandfather).

As far as I know, I am not related to anyone in this family.

Rgds,

BILL FIGUEROA

Bill,

 

Your posting left me speechless...  I have looked for Macario's birth/baptism info but didn't find anything and here you not only supply that information but much more.

 

Thank you so much for all this added information.

 

 I certainly enjoyed the links that Armanco provided for explaining the veiling ceremony.  I now will pay more attention when viewing marriage records looking for a reference to "casados y velados," or casados y no velados).

 

Do you think that one of the names you mentioned for Juana Gonzalez being Juana de la Cerda may be a reference to her association with the de la Cerda nobles that descend from Fernando de la Cerda, Infante d'Castile and his wife Branca de Franca?

 

Last evening I viewed the baptism record for Nicolas Torres Vasques (bapt 02 May 1622 Sagrario, Aguascalientes Image 18 of 324) and found it interesting that only a Godmother (Madinha) a Luisa de Avila (widow) was mentioned.  I also thought that the translation of Hernando's first name may even be something other than Hernando. 

Am I translating this correctly was there only a widow Godmother for Nicolas and not the usual two? Do you think this Luisa de Avila may be a relative?

 

Once again thank you so much for all the added information that you and Armando have supplied/provided.

 

Pat Silva Corbera

Tracy CA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Figueroa"
To: research@NuestrosRanchos.com
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2012 4:33:45 AM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241

Pat and Armando,

I think the links provided by Armando explain the veiling ceremony quite accurately.  Most veilings in Aguascalientes were performed during the wedding ceremony (casados y velados) although in some instances the veiling ceremony was performed later (casados y no velados).  As the marriage blessing was considered a celebration, it was not allowed during Advent and Lent (that are considered penance periods). Therefore, if the marriage was celebrated during these periods, a separate veiling ceremony (velación) was required to complete the marriage sacrament. That explains why sometimes marriage and veiling happened during the same day and sometimes on different dates.  Most often the priest recorded the wedding and veiling ceremonies in the same book (Libro de Matrimonios) either as an annotation next to the wedding or as a separate record.  I have not found any veilings recorded in separate parish books in Aguascalientes.

Macario de Espitia was baptized 21 Jan 1659 in Aguascalientes [ Film 0299421 Baptisms 1616-1660 Aguascalientes ] and buried 1 May 1732 [ Film 299856 Defunciones 1620-1752  Aguascalientes ].  He was the son of Bartolome de Espitia and Juana Gonzalez (aka Juana de la Cerda, Juana de Espinosa, Juana Lopez de Elizalde, Juana Gonzalez Lisardi).  The parents of Bartolome de Espitia were Francisco de Espitia and Francisca de Quiroga.

Macario's son Jacinto de Espitia was born 6 Sep 1688 and baptized 18 Sep 1688 in Aguascalientes.  His daughter Maria Teresa de Espitia was baptized 13 Aug 1697 also in Aguascalientes [ Film 299423 Baptisms 1684-1701 ]

I don't have any additional information about Simona de Silva except for her burial record, which you already have.

As far as Hernando de Torres Espitia is concerned, he was originally from Mexico City.  He married Juana Vazquez de Retamosa (aka Juana Macías) from Los Gallos 11 Jan 1615 in Aguascalientes.  This couple was veiled several years later on 17 Sep 1619 also in Aguascalientes.  Their children Magdalena, Juan and Nicolas de Torres were all baptized in Aguascalientes in 1618, 1620 and 1622.  I have not found any family link between Hernando de Torres Espitia and Macario de Espitia or his ancestors Bartolome (Macario's father) and Francisco de Espitia (his grandfather).

As far as I know, I am not related to anyone in this family.

Rgds,

BILL FIGUEROA

Bill and Armando,

 

Bill, In your previous posting you mentioned the following...

 

"Macario de Espitia was baptized 21 Jan 1659 in Aguascalientes [ Film 0299421 Baptisms 1616-1660 Aguascalientes ] and buried 1 May 1732 [ Film 299856 Defunciones 1620-1752 Aguascalientes ]. He was the son of Bartolome de Espitia and Juana Gonzalez (aka Juana de la Cerda, Juana de Espinosa, Juana Lopez de Elizalde, Juana Gonzalez Lisardi). The parents of Bartolome de Espitia were Francisco de Espitia and Francisca de Quiroga."

 

Bill, did you actually locate and view Macario's  bapt record ? 

 

I accessed the Aqauscalientes films, No Baptisms records for 1611 - 1660, but one for 1616 - 1662...so I viewed that one, it didn't have a film number so I couldn't verify it with the film # you provided...

 

Here's my findings...

 

 

1.  I couldn't locate a bapt record for Macario for 21 Jan 1659...very difficult for me to read....

 

2.  I did locate something rather interesting last entry on the right of   image 262 of 324

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-50415-14?cc=1410092&wc=6809985

It appears to be a marriage record for a Isabel Apitias...  plus it has a "veiling," notation.

 

This continues onto images 263 of 324...(top left page)

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-52247-20?cc=1410092&wc=6809985

The document side bar is referring to a Gaspar de Aguilar ???  The names of Francisco Aspitias and Francisca de Quiroga are mentioned in the text.

 

 3.  I don't know what to make of all  this...

 

4.  LDS has a listing for a Macario Aspitia Gijondes - male - baptism - 21 Jan 1659 -

El Sagrario, Aguascalientes,Aguascalientes, Mexico

Father: Bme.De Aspitia

Mother: Juana Gijondes

Batch: C604761  Film # 299421 

 

Is Gijondes another spelling variation for Gonzalez or is this an indexing error on the part of LDS input?

 

Pat Silva Corbera

Tracy, CA

 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Pat Corbera"
To: research@NuestrosRanchos.com
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2012 10:13:32 AM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241

Bill,

 

Your posting left me speechless...  I have looked for Macario's birth/baptism info but didn't find anything and here you not only supply that information but much more.

 

Thank you so much for all this added information.

 

 I certainly enjoyed the links that Armanco provided for explaining the veiling ceremony.  I now will pay more attention when viewing marriage records looking for a reference to "casados y velados," or casados y no velados).

 

Do you think that one of the names you mentioned for Juana Gonzalez being Juana de la Cerda may be a reference to her association with the de la Cerda nobles that descend from Fernando de la Cerda, Infante d'Castile and his wife Branca de Franca?

 

Last evening I viewed the baptism record for Nicolas Torres Vasques (bapt 02 May 1622 Sagrario, Aguascalientes Image 18 of 324) and found it interesting that only a Godmother (Madinha) a Luisa de Avila (widow) was mentioned.  I also thought that the translation of Hernando's first name may even be something other than Hernando. 

Am I translating this correctly was there only a widow Godmother for Nicolas and not the usual two? Do you think this Luisa de Avila may be a relative?

 

Once again thank you so much for all the added information that you and Armando have supplied/provided.

 

Pat Silva Corbera

Tracy CA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Figueroa"
To: research@NuestrosRanchos.com
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2012 4:33:45 AM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241

Pat and Armando,

I think the links provided by Armando explain the veiling ceremony quite accurately.  Most veilings in Aguascalientes were performed during the wedding ceremony (casados y velados) although in some instances the veiling ceremony was performed later (casados y no velados).  As the marriage blessing was considered a celebration, it was not allowed during Advent and Lent (that are considered penance periods). Therefore, if the marriage was celebrated during these periods, a separate veiling ceremony (velación) was required to complete the marriage sacrament. That explains why sometimes marriage and veiling happened during the same day and sometimes on different dates.  Most often the priest recorded the wedding and veiling ceremonies in the same book (Libro de Matrimonios) either as an annotation next to the wedding or as a separate record.  I have not found any veilings recorded in separate parish books in Aguascalientes.

Macario de Espitia was baptized 21 Jan 1659 in Aguascalientes [ Film 0299421 Baptisms 1616-1660 Aguascalientes ] and buried 1 May 1732 [ Film 299856 Defunciones 1620-1752  Aguascalientes ].  He was the son of Bartolome de Espitia and Juana Gonzalez (aka Juana de la Cerda, Juana de Espinosa, Juana Lopez de Elizalde, Juana Gonzalez Lisardi).  The parents of Bartolome de Espitia were Francisco de Espitia and Francisca de Quiroga.

Macario's son Jacinto de Espitia was born 6 Sep 1688 and baptized 18 Sep 1688 in Aguascalientes.  His daughter Maria Teresa de Espitia was baptized 13 Aug 1697 also in Aguascalientes [ Film 299423 Baptisms 1684-1701 ]

I don't have any additional information about Simona de Silva except for her burial record, which you already have.

As far as Hernando de Torres Espitia is concerned, he was originally from Mexico City.  He married Juana Vazquez de Retamosa (aka Juana Macías) from Los Gallos 11 Jan 1615 in Aguascalientes.  This couple was veiled several years later on 17 Sep 1619 also in Aguascalientes.  Their children Magdalena, Juan and Nicolas de Torres were all baptized in Aguascalientes in 1618, 1620 and 1622.  I have not found any family link between Hernando de Torres Espitia and Macario de Espitia or his ancestors Bartolome (Macario's father) and Francisco de Espitia (his grandfather).

As far as I know, I am not related to anyone in this family.

Rgds,

BILL FIGUEROA

Pat,

I've looked at what you have questions about.

1. This is the same as number four. The person that input the record wrote
it incorrectly because the priest had too much ink so it is hard to read
the surname. It does not say Gijondes. The L is wrote in the style of the
era and it is Lizarde. It states the parents are Bme de Aspitia (Espitia) y
Juana Lizarde (Elizalde) Padrinos Sebastian de Espinosa y Ana Garcia
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-51426-17?cc=1410092&wc=6809985

2. This record states that Isabel de Aspitia is the daughter of Francisco
de Aspitia and Francisca de Quiroga.

Armando

On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 5:32 PM, Pat Corbera wrote:

>
>
>
>
> Bill and Armando,
>
>
> Bill, In your previous posting you mentioned the following...
>
> "Macario de Espitia was baptized 21 Jan 1659 in Aguascalientes [ Film
> 0299421 Baptisms 1616-1660 Aguascalientes ] and buried 1 May 1732 [ Film
> 299856 Defunciones 1620-1752 Aguascalientes ]. He was the son of Bartolome
> de Espitia and Juana Gonzalez (aka Juana de la Cerda, Juana de Espinosa,
> Juana Lopez de Elizalde, Juana Gonzalez Lisardi). The parents of Bartolome
> de Espitia were Francisco de Espitia and Francisca de Quiroga."
>
> Bill, did you actually locate and view Macario's bapt record ?
>
>
> I accessed the Aqauscalientes films, No Baptisms records for 1611 - 1660,
> but one for 1616 - 1662...so I viewed that one, it didn't have a film
> number so I couldn't verify it with the film # you provided...
>
> Here's my findings...
>
>
> 1. I couldn't locate a bapt record for Macario for 21 Jan 1659...very
> difficult for me to read....
>
>
> 2. I did locate something rather interesting last entry on the right
> of image 262 of 324
>
>
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-50415-14?cc=1410092&wc=6809985
>
> It appears to be a marriage record for a Isabel Apitias... plus it has a
> "veiling," notation.
>
>
>
> This continues onto images 263 of 324...(top left page)
>
>
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-52247-20?cc=1410092&wc=6809985
>
> The document side bar is referring to a Gaspar de Aguilar ??? The names
> of Francisco Aspitias and Francisca de Quiroga are mentioned in the text.
>
>
> 3. I don't know what to make of all this...
>
>
> 4. LDS has a listing for a Macario Aspitia Gijondes - male - baptism - 21
> Jan 1659 -
>
> El Sagrario, Aguascalientes,Aguascalientes, Mexico
>
> Father: Bme.De Aspitia
>
> Mother: Juana Gijondes
>
> Batch: C604761 Film # 299421
>
>
> Is Gijondes another spelling variation for Gonzalez or is this an indexing
> error on the part of LDS input?
>
>
> Pat Silva Corbera
>
> Tracy, CA
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Pat Corbera"
> To: research@NuestrosRanchos.com
> Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2012 10:13:32 AM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of
> 241
>
>

Armando,
 
Thank you.
 
I was getting confused by seeing marriage and baptism records on the listing for Bautismos 1616 - 1662  No mention of marriages being included in this grouping of records.
 
Ranchos Members...
Note: If you're research Aguascalientes  Batch # M604761 & Batch # C604761 Film # 299421 these records can be found at Mexico - Catholic Church Records --Sagrario -- Aguascalientes  Bautismos 1616 - 1662.
 
Pat Silva Corbera
Tracy, CA

----- Original Message -----

From: "Armando"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.com
Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2012 6:35:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of 241 / Macario de Espitia

Pat,

I've looked at what you have questions about.

1. This is the same as number four. The person that input the record wrote
it incorrectly because the priest had too much ink so it is hard to read
the surname. It does not say Gijondes. The L is wrote in the style of the
era and it is Lizarde. It states the parents are Bme de Aspitia (Espitia) y
Juana Lizarde (Elizalde) Padrinos Sebastian de Espinosa y Ana Garcia
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-51426-17?cc=1410092&wc=6809985

2. This record states that Isabel de Aspitia is the daughter of Francisco
de Aspitia and Francisca de Quiroga.

Armando

On Sat, Feb 25, 2012 at 5:32 PM, Pat Corbera wrote:

>
>
>
>
> Bill and Armando,
>
>
> Bill, In your previous posting you mentioned the following...
>
> "Macario de Espitia was baptized 21 Jan 1659 in Aguascalientes [ Film
> 0299421 Baptisms 1616-1660 Aguascalientes ] and buried 1 May 1732 [ Film
> 299856 Defunciones 1620-1752 Aguascalientes ]. He was the son of Bartolome
> de Espitia and Juana Gonzalez (aka Juana de la Cerda, Juana de Espinosa,
> Juana Lopez de Elizalde, Juana Gonzalez Lisardi). The parents of Bartolome
> de Espitia were Francisco de Espitia and Francisca de Quiroga."
>
> Bill, did you actually locate and view Macario's  bapt record ?
>
>
> I accessed the Aqauscalientes films, No Baptisms records for 1611 - 1660,
> but one for 1616 - 1662...so I viewed that one, it didn't have a film
> number so I couldn't verify it with the film # you provided...
>
> Here's my findings...
>
>
> 1.  I couldn't locate a bapt record for Macario for 21 Jan 1659...very
> difficult for me to read....
>
>
> 2.  I did locate something rather interesting last entry on the right
> of   image 262 of 324
>
>
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-50415-14?cc=1410092&wc=6809985
>
> It appears to be a marriage record for a Isabel Apitias...  plus it has a
> "veiling," notation.
>
>
>
> This continues onto images 263 of 324...(top left page)
>
>
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11824-52247-20?cc=1410092&wc=6809985
>
> The document side bar is referring to a Gaspar de Aguilar ???  The names
> of Francisco Aspitias and Francisca de Quiroga are mentioned in the text.
>
>
>  3.  I don't know what to make of all  this...
>
>
> 4.  LDS has a listing for a Macario Aspitia Gijondes - male - baptism - 21
> Jan 1659 -
>
> El Sagrario, Aguascalientes,Aguascalientes, Mexico
>
> Father: Bme.De Aspitia
>
> Mother: Juana Gijondes
>
> Batch: C604761  Film # 299421
>
>
> Is Gijondes another spelling variation for Gonzalez or is this an indexing
> error on the part of LDS input?
>
>
> Pat Silva Corbera
>
> Tracy, CA
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Pat Corbera"
> To: research@NuestrosRanchos.com
> Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2012 10:13:32 AM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help Needed - Simona De Silva Image 33 of
> 241
>
>

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